Direct-Fit Wheels for RWD Volvo/Holden - Solve a Mystery

familyman

I used to own a 1986 240. A few people told me the wheels on it were Holden wheels. I didn't take a picture of them at the time. But I'm pretty sure this is the same wheel:

We know for a wheel to be a direct fit (no spacers, no guard-rolling) onto a RWD Volvo such as a 240, wheels need to be 5x108, ET20-ET25.

Now... Some time ago I posted a link to an ad for some Holden wheels. That thread was closed because I got the PCD/holden models wrong. That thread is here:

https://ozvolvo.org/discussion/4731/four-14-x-7-plus-one-1x-14-x-6-roh-wheels-to-suit-rwd-volvos

In that thread tezza rightly said: "HQ to WB are 120 x 5 not 5 x 108 so won't fit a Volvo."

So I've been searching for which Holden model originally came with (or can be fitted with) the wheels in the picture above. I found several ads but only a couple mentioned specific models. One stated the wheels were used on a VK Calais, the other said they were running on a VQ Caprice.

I know next to nothing about Holden models. But I do know VK & VQ are newer than Toranas (which are nearly the same 5x108 PCD). And they are also newer than a HQ (which I think was the first Holden to switch to a 5x120 PCD). This means the wheels in the picture above should also be 5x120. (And even if I have the wrong picture, the wheels above are so close that they have to be circa the same age.)

Question: That being the case, how on earth did the wheels above fit my mid-80s 240 ?

Vee_Que

They made multi pattern fit wheels.

Also, torana was the last holden to use 5x108. All commodores went to metric 5x120, where hq-wb is 5x4.5"

VQ caprice rims are similar, but not that rim also fwiw. I've seen them on fords also.

So the answer is, don't bother and get better looking rims in a bigger size.

Vee_Que

Otherwise they were this rim. Stock on lots of 240s in the 80s

tbro

Those wheel you have a picture were an aftermarket wheel (if memory serves me right) CSA wheels.
CSA definately didn't do multifit rims, very professional manufacture.
I've only ever seen them on Dunnydores and Facoons, certainly no Toronas.
Maybe a Performance rim as they tended to knock off other manufactures designs.

Sorry can't help any further.

Tezza

familyman

Thanks for the replies.

Vee_Que;85393 wrote Also, torana was the last holden to use 5x108. All commodores went to metric 5x120, where hq-wb is 5x4.5"
VQ caprice rims are similar, but not that rim also fwiw. I've seen them on fords also.
So the answer is, don't bother and get better looking rims in a bigger size.

I've now read a Holden site that claims 4 cylinder Holdens (modern like VKs) have a different PCD to 6 cylinders of the same vintage. Claims the 4s have the same PCD, something like 5x107.95 !? Surely that can't be right: two cars, same manufacturer, same vintage, different PCD between a 4 & 6 cylinder!? But in the thread I saw no-one contradicted him. Is that correct?

No they're not the common aluminium Volvo wheel in VQ's pic. Because when I first saw the pic I've posted above, I didn't remember the slots around the outside being quite the same. That could just be my memory being a bit off though. But if it <i>is</i> a different wheel, then they are certainly from the same manufacturer. Because mine had that same centre cap with a single hole. They require a small key to unscrew a single bolt that has an anti-theft head. Then you pull the centre cap free, which has a large o-ring around the outside to seal the wheel nut area from the weather.

They were great rims. Nearly as shiny as chrome and so easy to clean.

And unfortunately it's more difficult than just buying better bigger rims. In NSW spacers are illegal. So you'd have to keep a spare set of wheels lying around just for rego time. No spacers rules out so many wheels, there's virtually none left. It basically leaves:

* Virgo
* Draco
* Gemini
* IPD Polaris replicas to get the correct offset (nla)
* Galaxy (rare)
* Simmons (rare)
* Eiker E1 (overseas import)

And these:

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/321803788766
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/221822270848
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/222019004415

Swapping the discs to a different PCD is an option, but that mean$ machining new disc$ every brake 1-2 changes.

tbro;85430 wroteThose wheel you have a picture were an aftermarket wheel (if memory serves me right) CSA wheels. Maybe a Performance rim as they tended to knock off other manufactures designs.

Funny you say that. I thought I'd seen a brand on them. But then two different guys stopped me in the street (two different times) to 'talk Volvo'... and they were certain they were Holden wheels. The second guy was so adamant they were Holden, he was offended when I suggested different. So later I looked for a brand but couldn't find one. Maybe I imagined it the first time, or missed it the second. But all I found was the PCD specs behind the cap.

Maybe the 4/6 cylinder thing is correct after all. @Vee_Que ?

tbro

http://transamraceengineering.com/product-category/wheels/

Vee_Que

The 4cyl commodores used a 4 Stud pattern if they were different. Not 5x107

The eikers are available in the country. You've forgotten hydras also.

And Darren has minilite style bolt on rims also

egads (she/her)

Spacers from the OEM are legal and Volvo did do a spacer. Part made the same and punch the part number on the side and keep a copy of the parts may.

Rob

Vee_Que;85474 wroteThe 4cyl commodores used a 4 Stud pattern if they were different. Not 5x107

The eikers are available in the country. You've forgotten hydras also.

And Darren has minilite style bolt on rims also

Starfire Commodores are 5x108

familyman

Finally found the page again!

http://oldschool.co.nz/index.php?/topic/46325-vk-commodore-stud-pattern/

"What stud are vk commodores. I'm thinking of buying one without wheels and I've just got some 5x120 steel rims to put on. I've read somewhere that 4 cylinder vk's are different than a 6 cylinder."

"4 cylinder is 5/108 - shared with Torana's, HT-K-G Holdens (some Saab/Volvo's also)"

"6 cyl and V8 are 5/120."

"... the four cylinder VK Commodores share their PCD with the pre-HQ Holdens, that's 4.25" (or 107.95 in millimetres). The six and eight Cylinder VKs have a 5x120mm stud pattern. Holden used the 5x120mm stud pattern for all Commodores."

So according to the above conversation, 4 cylinder VKs are 5x108, but 6 & 8 cylinder VKs are 5x120. The guy in the last quote confirms that, but then seems to contradict himself. i.e. First he says 4 cylinder VK Commodores are 5x108 PCD, then he says all commodores are 5x120.

Can anyone decipher what's going on here?

peterwgpa

There was a wheel called Centra that Came in 16 inch and I have seen them on HDT VH commodores and Mercedes Benz from early 1980's.

In terms of making sense its pretty much covered.

5*108 holden up to HG and LC and LJ torana
5*120 dunnydores and discount the possible variant as if it was true it would be so rare mores chance winning lotto finding it.

Then you have the HQ-WB and remaining torana

Vee_Que

Vk? They stopped with? Cyl commodores on the vh commodore! As in 1984 at the latest in Australia. in new Zealand maybe yes, but not in Australia, and they aren't exactly a popular car..

I personally think your search is fruitless and you should persue other more viable options like fwd volvo rims with volvo stamped spacers, most workshops won't care.

Major Ledfoot

Vee_Que;85529 wroteVk? They stopped with? Cyl commodores on the vh commodore! As in 1984 at the latest in Australia. in new Zealand maybe yes, but not in Australia,

NZ got the Backfire 4 for many years, and then they got a version of the VN Commodore with a 2 litre Family II from the Camira.

Funny - I had a 4 cyl VC about 20 years ago that we put a 304 / M21 / 3.08 LSD in for street sedan'ing, but I can't remember the PCD of the original wheels.

deleted_user_160

Lots of options out there. Not to mention Getting the pcd changed. There is a coulme wheel works that willlegallychanfe the pcd of wheels. There are some guidelines surrounding this though nothing major.

Alternatively like VQ said, Volvo stamped spacers. Which were a catalogue option with the cars from new

Ex850R

Or any spacers , no one cares , unless you have a fatality in a crash.

Go Porsche wheel pcd , you can get cheap Porsche Cayenne 17/18/19" wheels out there.

deleted_user_160

We do get over looked significantly in Volvos. Though in Vic they regularly do checks

familyman

Vee_Que;85529 wroteI personally think your search is fruitless and you should persue other more viable options like fwd volvo rims with volvo stamped spacers, most workshops won't care.

Yeah, I've only ever been told 'spacers are illegal in NSW' - period. So I might look into this more.

Are adapters also illegal in NSW?

Ex850R;85579 wroteOr any spacers , no one cares , unless you have a fatality in a crash.

Well, I have limited choices of mechanic here. And none will pass a rego with spacers. Just more frustrating government rules for the sake of it. So you'd have to swap wheels, go for rego check, go home and swap the back again. Then when those 'rego tyres' start cracking, they'll want new ones of those too - for a set I won't even use. Maybe they'll pass stamped spacers. But I suspect they wouldn't even be aware of this exception so would still say no. That remains to be seen though.

Go Porsche wheel pcd , you can get cheap Porsche Cayenne 17/18/19" wheels out there.

Hm... ebay shows Porsche Cayenne wheels are PCD 5x130 and 50 offset.

Ex850R

Yeah , change your pcd. More options then.

familyman

Ex850R;85609 wroteYeah , change your pcd. More options then.

Maybe if I can legally - using adapters. (Otherwise it means continuously machining new rotors, yes?)

Vee_Que

Continually? You change rotors how often? Hope many kms a year do you do?