Vee_Que
2.5" is too small to really take advantage of even the stock turbo. Its the budget option basically. Turbos have no restriction behind the turbo as its all in the manifold to turbo that counts, which is why putting the later manifold that flows better (more direct exhaust flow to the turbo, less turbulance) is a good idea, you gain botton end power just by doing that.
Ex850R
I don't get the 2.5" cat back options.
The R had a 2.5 exhaust anyway!
I agree the later mani gives you noticeable feel of improvement even on std exhaust.
*edit, it's 21/4 not 21/2", I just measured the v70t one I cut off.
The S70T5 I used to have had muffler shop made (probably 2.5) one cat back I assume but a muffler delete which drowned horribly.
It had noticeable more power but had a chip tune of some sort anyway.
Have a shop make you a 3" back one as you are going to upgrade all the other parts anyway. You can then put a couple of high flow mufflers and not worry about drone. (which you may think is not a problem but believe me it gets pretty ordinary pretty quickly on the freeway, even commuting....)
Julian
Yeah ok, I might start keeping an eye out for a Kinugawa 19T and investigate the downpipe options (ie: getting one made as mentioned or buying one of the OBX from the US if I can find someone selling one).
When you say the 19T is a rod bender, would you say that fitting one is a "risky" modification? Do many people actually bend connecting rods doing that kind of thing? As much as I'd like to do some modifications to my car, it is also essentially my daily driver, so I want to keep it fairly reliable and not have it walking a fine line between running and blowing up.
Ex850R
The 19T with an 11 blade turbines wheel negates the most of the compressor surge spikes that are reported by some as rod benders.
It's talked about a lot but we never really see any massive amount of evidence or other supporting modifications listed so do it proper and it's fine.
Don't wind up the boost.
Use good fuel.
Julian
Ok, so just doing a bit of an ebay trawl, I am looking at a few items below.
The first is
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kinugawa-Turbo-Billet-CHRA-Upgrade-Kit-VOLVO-T5-850-S60-S70-V70-TD04HL-19T-320HP-/282022206780?hash=item41a9d55d3c:g:FTMAAOxyXDhSoe0b
And am I right in thinking that the below item is the same as above but with a bigger outlet?
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kinugawa-Monster-Turbocharger-Upgrade-VOLVO-740-940-TD04HL-19T-w-7cm-Housing-/291738791643?hash=item43ecfcaedb:g:ZZAAAOSwbqpTtSB7
Lastly, what would be the drawback of getting something like the below? Would this essentially make my current turbo a 19T?
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kinugawa-Turbo-Upgrade-Compressor-Kit-Mitsubishi-TD04H-TD04HL-19T-3000GT-TRUSTs-/291758858586?hash=item43ee2ee15a:g:OpcAAOSwV0RXqAr-
Are these the type of things I should be looking at, or any recommendations between them?
As mentioned, whilst I have done a reasonable amount of mechanical work and would feel confident doing these upgrades, I haven't really had any experience pulling turbos apart so have a bit to learn there.
Thanks for the advice so far.
94_850_t5
The first item on your Ebay list is the 19t you would want for an 850 series but does not include the exhaust turbine housing. Presuming you keep your existing downpipe (DP) then you can fit this unit to your existing housing and nothing else is required.
If however you want to change to a more efficient exhaust turbine housing (angle fitting) then you would need to buy the following and then find yourself a suitable DP.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kinugawa-Turbo-Turbine-Housing-VOLVO-850-S70-TD04HL-7cm-Angle-Flange-52-45-6mm-/272228573451?hash=item3f6216610b:g:K4wAAOSwxg5X1lmT
The second item on your list is designed to bolt onto a 740turbo redblock motor. Basically the same turbo otherwise.
The third item is an option but introduces unknown cost and some risk given that you really need to have this job done properly and the turbine shaft balanced by professionals.
Hope this info helps. You can also search the Kinugawa website for other options.
I've used both Kinugawa 19t and 20t variations and they were great little turbos.
Hope that helps, let me know if not clear.
nickm
Go the Drop in CRHA with compressor housing and if you upgrade the manifold get the Exhaust housing
Julian
Thanks for that guys. So it looks like the first option may be the goer, but from what I've seen with the different flanges, the angled type seem to be the least common to come standard on our cars. Does this mean that finding a suitable downpipe is more difficult than it would be for a straight or conical flange if I decide to eventually get the larger turbine housing?
Also (and this may sound like a silly question) but as for the advice above about not increasing boost pressure, what is it about upgrading turbo that actually yields the performance benefits if boost pressure remains constant? Can these larger turbos just deliver a higher flow rate of air at X psi thn my current turbo is able to at X psi?
Ex850R
More flow.
Get a big intercooler or air to water one it helps a lot even the cheap ebay one I am trying now before I go air to water.
Any conical turbo outlet should be wrapped in explosives gel and detonated. .
94_850_t5
@Julian The angle flange probably is the least common on the 850s but best option in terms of airflow and performance.
If you are only working toward mild performance improvements but are genuinely considering going to a 19t, then stick with your existing exhaust housing and spend the money on an ECU upgrade which will give you some genuine performance gains.
Simply changing to a 19t won't offer you alot in terms of performance gains. In order to take full advantage of this change then ECU update/upgrade would be warranted.
Whilst ever the ECU manages the boost within accepted norms I don't think you risk bending rods. I may have said previously that this is most likely the result of going to a manual boost controller.
Philia_Bear
94_850_t5;92446 wrote@Julian The angle flange probably is the least common on the 850s but best option in terms of airflow and performance.
If you are only working toward mild performance improvements but are genuinely considering going to a 19t, then stick with your existing exhaust housing and spend the money on an ECU upgrade which will give you some genuine performance gains.
Simply changing to a 19t won't offer you alot in terms of performance gains. In order to take full advantage of this change then ECU update/upgrade would be warranted.
Whilst ever the ECU manages the boost within accepted norms I don't think you risk bending rods. I may have said previously that this is most likely the result of going to a manual boost controller.
+1 to all of this
Rica is doing the best value on tunes at the moment and the stage 2 tune on most 850's is phenomenal value and produces a really good result on every car I have seen it on
Julian
Ok, so I am fairly seriously considering getting one of the 19t turbos, and think that if I'm ever going to do the housing I might as well drop the $200 or so for the 7cm housing and do it whilst I swap the turbo. I suppose this would then allow me to get a downpipe that fits the housing I might eventually want anyway.
I'd be interested in an ecu upgrade, and have also heard other people say that rica do a good job. Are there other supporting modifications that are required when going for the stage 2? E.g.: injectors, fuel pressure reg, bigger intercooler or anything? I checked their website but could only seem to find a listing for a stage 1 upgrade- would be good to know the price of the stage 2
Ex850R
I do know a $200 eboy aluminium intercooler will give you a good result. Sure it's not bar and plate but I am loving mine. The ecu will compensate.
Don't know what Rica needs, surely it's on the net? They have been round for ages.
@Jamest5r_ has mate in UK, HLM I think, they do good cheap tunes, Jimmy?
Ex850R
Philia_Bear
All td04hl turbos are 7cm housings
Just have 3 designs of outlets
Julian
Thanks guys.
Does anyone have further info on a stage 2 tune from Rica? As mentioned I can only find the stage 1 info on their website, and whilst I'd be keen to do this, it would be dependant on the extent of supporting modifications required.
Also, does this require me to remove my ecu, tell them what equipment I am running and send it to them for modification? Or do they just send a modified ecu so you still have your original one unmodified? And lets say that later on down the track I decided to do some other engine mod, would this render the tuned ecu unsuitable, or would it compensate?
Lots of questions, but want to make sure I know what I'm getting myself in for!
Philia_Bear
what year 850?
96+ can be done via OBD2 port from memory
Julian
Mine is a 1996 and has the obd2 port
Jamest5r_
Ex850R;92472 wroteI do know a $200 eboy aluminium intercooler will give you a good result. Sure it's not bar and plate but I am loving mine. The ecu will compensate.
Don't know what Rica needs, surely it's on the net? They have been round for ages.
@Jamest5r_ has mate in UK, HLM I think, they do good cheap tunes, Jimmy?
HLM don't map the older car's anymore the only 2 that are worth using are Shem Green (shemtec) on Facebook I think and Tim Williams but you'll never get hold of him.
Julian
Ok, I had a bit of a chat with Mark from VP tuning today. I was actually trying to chase some IPD sway bars (since my rear one is snapped) but asked about his thoughts on ECUs. He said that VP tuning do an ECU upgrade, which flashes the existing ECU rather than replace any chips, which costs about $990. Any thoughts on this compared to one from Rica? Still having a bit of trouble finding what's involved in a Rica "stage 2"- is the ECU tune different, or is "stage 2" just the same modified ECU but with different supporting mods?