m 400 in 140

Garth

Will the m 400 gearbox fit up to a m40 bell housing? 142 needs a gearbox and I have a m400 I'm not using at the moment paid a lot for the thing a few years back would be good to use the thing

Major Ledfoot

Garth wroteWill the m 400 gearbox fit up to a m40 bell housing?

No, going by the part numbers. The M400 / M410 bellhousing for the B18/B20 is part number 381167-8 and the M40/M41 bellhousing for the B18/B20 is 419311-6.

The 381167-8 bellhousing is rare since it was used in the 1800E for one (production) year only, when they fitted the M410 behind the first run of B20E engines.

Sorry, I couldn't tell you how to make one fit or describe the physical differences, since I'm only going by the numbers.

Angus242164

Yep M400 to B20 bellhousing is very rare and sought after by P1800 owners.

I know of a 140 with B20 that was using an M400 about 15 years ago, I don't think it had a P1800 bellhousing, I'm not sure what modifications were done to make it work though.

Rob

The M400/410 and M40/41 have a very different bellhousing pattern. On top of this the M40 bellhousing attachment bolts come through from the rear while the M400 bolts come in from inside the bellhousing.

While nothing is impossible there is no easy way to modify any of the standard equipment to fit, the only option is to find a unicorn bellhousing from the 1800E.

1971_144GL

I have a 164 manual bell housing I plan to sell. possibly a solution? But why not fix the m40? Pretty good box for a standard historic car. I like them anyway, nice mechanical feel.

Garth

I have a complete 164 setup cost me $800.00 years back then bought new clutch and release bearing owes me around 1200.00 so was attempting to capitalise on the investment as I wont put the 164 back on the road
Its soon to lose its timing cover and rear seal housing too

Garth

Eyeing up other parts as well aircon and power steer in it already raided discs and front and rear arb for the 142

Garth

The m 40 actually works ok cant beat the synchros in it but the noise it makes-- either it has straight cut gears or very tired cluster

Angus242164

I've got an M40 that sounds like that too, just internal wear I assume.

Garth

I put so many new and expensive parts in the 164 so hope to use as much as I can in the 142 build the original owner rocked up with many new parts as well so apart from engine rebuild and gearbox I have all I need. Just have to track down a park light lens and indicator lens to complete it

Garth

Wouldn't it be nice to have one of these you wouldn't mind if it howled then

Garth

egads (she/her)

Problem solved!

1971_144GL

The problem with the m40 tends to be wear of the case hardening on the rear end of the lay shafts, the little needle bearings don't seem to last without good lubrication. Or metal particles accumulate. The shaft then runs off centre by a few thou and the box seems to get noisy. But it sounds worse than it is, gears tend to be fine in my experience Parts still available for a reasonable price too. I wouldn't give up on repair at a reasonable price, when compared to the price of a second hand box of unknown condition. Given that they are not getting any more common, I think they are worth fixing. About an hour to dismantle and five to clean and reassemble and get set up just right. A good Saturday job.
I still plan to do a 164 steering conversion at some stage. I will write it up when I do, as some of the work is more complicated than at first glance, issues like the spline difference between the two types of steering arms need to be overcome.

Vee_Que

The car i got my latest motor from has a 164 power steering setup in it.

egads (she/her)

I will take some photos of how the 164 system has been put in once I have it home

deleted_user_160

Ooooooo straight cuts!!!!!!!! Oooooooo ooooooooo oooooooo I love straigh cut gearboxes :D

I would love a 5speed (Volvo or not) or even a 4speed+OD, that can maintain the early magic wand shifter position. That would make me very happy

Angus242164

There are M41's that achieve that, not common in Australia though.

deleted_user_160

Yeah I have seen them from time to time. Even the m46 with a b20 belhousing out of the US. Although they want r154/w58 money for them.
Which is ultimately ridiculous.
Though I've got another plan. Will test it out on my r150