deleted_user_160
I've hunted and hunted for some evidence that someone has created their own timing gear set for the pushrod family.
Lots talk about changing to the steel gear (from wood fiber) of the b30 for their b18/20 engines. And the talk is increase in noise. Note that these are still helical cut gears.
A screaming set of straights would be ace. And would be another addition to assisting me in keeping the b20 in my 142 for some time.
Vee_Que
Thread title made me think about straight cut gear on the gearbox. May need to Change it to include the words timing gears.
Why do you need them created? The angle of the steel timing gear is helical, but straighter than the weaker fibre ones.
There is also an aluminium option.
I personally am going to steel due to cam choice and the fact the fibre ones will only last 100,000km in a stock motor, let alone one with a higher lift cam with double valve springs. the noise.... Well, I will have the interior sound proofed more than stock, just like you are going to do, which makes it seem silly to want the noise if you need to block it out?
If the motors making over 200rwhp in Sweden use the b30 steep gears, I doubt there is straight cut ones. Besides... The noise would be like a cat or Cummins 15l, its actually not plesant!
Kg trimming and ipd and p1800-122 parts site all stock new steel gears.
1971_144GL
You want it to sound that way? You will give us old volvo drivers a bad name.
If you must, Gear Design in Melbourne can make pretty much anything gear wise. They are surprisingly cost effective for one off jobs, and their materials and finish are as good as you could hope for. They will sound terrible, and throw off lots of tiny metal fragments at high RPM, probably giving reduced cam and lifter life among other things.
I use steel in two b20's, and don't notice any real noise difference.
Major Ledfoot
1971_144GL;72525 wrote
I use steel in two b20's, and don't notice any real noise difference.
This. And Redwood Chair from TB has a set of steel timing gears for sale. They're used, but they generally don't wear.
deleted_user_160
I have the steel gear given to me.
I also have almost half inch lift and 300 duration cam. Twin webers, on injected ported head, with thin HG. Running to a side pipe. Painted in "March 17" torana green.
Amongst my 740 wagon which is far from "old man Volvo driver" (much like when the t5 box needs rebuild it will get 1-4 SC syncro gear set)
I've grown up listening to big v8's and track based cars with straight cut ting gears and straight cut gearboxes. I've owned quad OHC bikes and ride a pushrod quad cam (straight cut) v-twin sports bike. (Factory cams) I love the wine (not that the buell has any form of cam drive noise)
I'm guessing I'll sus out the local guys, give them my old units and ask them to copy in a SC configuration.
And no it won't sound like a big truck diesel. Well because it's not a big truck diesel.
Edit: I should also add the thread title states b18/20/30 these are well engines, not gearboxes. So this is why I felt no need to add the term timing gear etc
Vee_Que
The cam spec you told me is an "r" cam. It's not that extreme. wasnt 300 degree duration, and it was 11mm?
Rick122S
I doubt you would be able to find anyone making straight cut gears for the B20. The only advantage is less axial loading, which is not really a problem with a redblock. Helical cut gears are actually stronger. I noticed a slight noise increase when changing to the steel timing gears from the fibre (which had 1/3 of the teeth missing!).
deleted_user_160
The cam spec I told you was
.430" lift
300duration
It was you that mentioned it was the R-sport copy.
As David mentioned I'll give gear design a call Monday. See what they have to say.
Ideally it's not performance or anything else I'm chasing other than the beautiful whir or the gears. Wonderful sound.
Not the mechanical noise people are talking about with the steel helical gears. Of which majority of people using them seem to say they don't notice much difference.
Yes I've said I don't like my car screaming at highway speeds @3000rpm. Though it's not so much the noise coming through the firewall, but the fact I don't like the ending screaming at that rpm. Especially for a 15hr trip up to nationals.
Vee_Que
The engine and many others are designed to rev at that speed for cruising, drive most Japanese 4cyls up to the mid 2000s, its not an issue! Only bigger engines above 3lts didn't need to rev as high...
The issue with the spec was you didn't know if it was advertised lift and duration. The lift starts at. 50' usually, but the specs you have don't match directly.
Vee_Que
As mentioned before, its not that big a cam. Even if it actually has those specs.
Vee_Que
deleted_user_160
The specs I gave you were the specs Milton gave me, who had the cam gound locally.
If it wasn't an issue we would all be still doing it.
Much like you are saying with your b20 your looking for a modern cam spec, ideally i would like to not have the the engine screaming for that period of time. Though let's not get off topic.
jamesinc
Is there no material you can use that is more durable than wood fiber but less noisy than steel?
Vee_Que
Aluminium timing gear is available. The fibre ones apparently fail above 100,000kms when driving hard, or break sooner with lots of hard on off throttle input at higher revs. ie racing.
They don't do it now because of having extra gears, like 8, so they can kick down to have power to overtake or go.up a hill. But hey, why not just pretend its a 4l super torquey falcon motor and not a 40 year old non crossflow pushrod all iron motor?
Major Ledfoot
jamesinc;72589 wroteIs there no material you can use that is more durable than wood fiber but less noisy than steel?
It's a myth that the factory steel timing gears make a B18 / B20 noisier, usually told by <strike> stealers </strike> dealers who want to sell you the over-priced fibre timing gears which fail. The B20 was never shy anyway when it comes to the decibel department, especially with all that tappet noise happening .
Camshaft and lifter wear can be a major issue in these engines if care isn't taken during rebuilding. Good assembly lube is a must, as is ensuring new lifters are used with a new cam, and that the cam lobes are suitably hardened. Or if you're re-using the old cam and lifters, ensure the lifters go back in the same way so they're facing the same cam lobe.
deleted_user_160
Yet another thread dampened with negativity. I'm closing it, no need for "your wrong" and " you can't do that" "
Thanks to those that assisted even if it isn't their thing.
