Slowbrick
Maybe another approach would be to buy a nice clean auto wagon and do the conversion. Most of the manual's ive seen are in average shape because they are "used" a little different to their auto brothers. Another advantage of doing the conversion is you know the clutch is nice and new.
lasercowboy
@Slowbrick does raise a good point. The challenge is in finding the flywheel and front propshaft section for the conversion. This will essentially require a donor car (or some creative importing from Europe), and will depend how patient you can be!
For this very reason, manuals are going up in price, even for pretty ordinary examples.
240
Slowbrick;54303 wroteMaybe another approach would be to buy a nice clean auto wagon and do the conversion.
I thought about that... how hard is it to do? I don't have great facilities and I've only really done simple jobs on cars in the past like changing a radiator. (Although I do have a friend who's a mechanic who could potentially help.)
Slowbrick
If you get an 86 - 88 then the flywheel issue isnt really an issue as you dont need the special flywheel. The front propshaft can be a little difficult to find but if you get a donor car that is in average condition then it will have everything you need.
Slowbrick
240;54305 wroteSlowbrick;54303 wroteMaybe another approach would be to buy a nice clean auto wagon and do the conversion.
I thought about that... how hard is it to do? I don't have great facilities and I've only really done simple jobs on cars in the past like changing a radiator. (Although I do have a friend who's a mechanic who could potentially help.)
I did mine with some friends in a driveway. Looking back it took us a weekend but we didnt know very much back then so things were far more difficult than they needed to be. If you get a donor car and pull all the bits then it will make it easier to fit to your own car. You will also take away from the job not just a manual 240 but boosted self confidence to do more and more work on your car. Everything is a learning experience and there is no reason why you shouldnt give it a go. It can be done with hand tools with the main help coming from a good floor jack and a nice space to do it with. I say if you plan on getting your hands dirty then just do it. The worst that can happen is you dont get it quite right and you try again.
240
lasercowboy;54304 wrote@Slowbrick does raise a good point. The challenge is in finding the flywheel and front propshaft section for the conversion. This will essentially require a donor car (or some creative importing from Europe), and will depend how patient you can be!
Hopefully I'd be able to find a donor car then... I'm not in a big hurry which is good.
Are the M46 or M47 manuals better? From a driving point of view obviously 5 gears is better than 4 + OD but I've heard the M47's aren't very reliable, is that true?
240
Thanks @Slowbrick. If I can get hold of a decent auto one, I'll think about doing that then.
Is using a clutch from a donor car OK or would I be better off buying a new one?
Slowbrick
Heres a quick breakdown of the 3 types of gearbox you are likely to encounter:
M45: This one is a 4 speed only. It has an iron case. It is the smallest and lightest of all the three. I will have a course spline input shaft and I beleive it will only work with the flat flywheel. I havent tried it in another setting. Behind an NA car they are alot of fun and the revs will always we quite high which is favourable for an NA car. Main downfall is that they only have 4 speeds so on the highway the car will be a bit buzzy. Expect over 3k while cruising at over 100km. The M45 has the smallest diameter driveshaft. I havent broken one but i would say by looking at it that it would be the weakest.
M46: The M46 is basically the M45 with an electronic overdrive. The overdrive unit is operated by a solenoid. The m46 is the most common box that you will come across. The first 4 gears are as far as I know the same as the M45 with the 5 being located at the back. The m46 has a weak spot in 3rd and WILL break if you are putting alot of power through it and mess up a shift into 3rd. Behind an NA car it will be a happy thing as long as you keep good oil in it and shift properly. The OD units can be a bit troublesome if not looked after in respect to keeping the right amount of oil in the box and using the clutch when shifting into 3rd. The M46 will have two types of input shaft. One type is the earlier type that uses the course spline and is typically found in 240s. The fine spline is typically found in 740 turbos and is the more "desirable" type as i believe it has a better OD unit.
M47: The M47 is the weakest of the bunch. It has an aluminum case and can be identified by its white body. These were only ever used behind NA 240s and were never used behind turbos. They can be used behind turbos but expect it to blow up if you mess up or ask too much of it. M47's have a "real" 5th gear that you shift into with the shifter. If these are not oiled properly then the 5th will get noisy. Its a good idea to "overfill" these to properly lubricate the 5th gear. These will only have the fine spline input shaft and if you find an M47 donor car then it will most likely have the special flywheel.
That being said, these days T5's and W series boxes are more affordable and there are more cars running around with them. If you are planning a turbo conversion of any sort of power then it would be in your best interest to use a T5 or W series box in your conversion to save doing it later. I do have a 240 turbo with an M46 but I am quite careful about the way I shift it and so far nothing has gone bang. Others havent been so lucky.
Slowbrick
240;54309 wroteThanks
@Slowbrick. If I can get hold of a decent auto one, I'll think about doing that then.
Is using a clutch from a donor car OK or would I be better off buying a new one?
Buy a new one and be done with it. No point using a worn clutch and changing it later.
240
Thanks for that overview of the different types of boxes.
I'm not going to be doing anything with turbos, so no worry there.
My dad used to have a 240 with an M46 and I don't think it ever had any problems in 520,000 kms (except for a broken OD) so that seems like a good choice - although I don't think I'd be treating the gearbox very roughly (definitely not in day-to-day use anyway) so I could probably get away with an M47 too.
I haven't even got a 240 yet though so I won't get too worked up about it!
Slowbrick
Put it this way. I have a 240 turbo running 10psi through an M46. It had 300k on it when I got it and ive put about 140k on it. It doesnt live an easy life but it doesnt get abused either. The fluid gets changed every 30k and its always warmed up before it gets subjected to any real work. It shifts nice and im yet to blow it up. We also have a 245 with a turbo motor and it was running an M47 before it all got pulled apart for a refurb. That box had 370k on it when it was put in. It was used for towing bikes and trailers when we moved and it never gave us any issue. If you treat them nicely they will treat you nicely back.
A_Volvo_Driver
There was an auto 240 wagon on ebay last week for $1200. As Black Dynamite mentioned, converting an auto to a manual is probably the easiest way to get a manual wagon.
Depending on where you're based, there are probably some forum members who could help you out with parts or the actual conversion.
perko
For a rough time to do the conversion, I pulled one out the weekend before last in half an hour using a rattle gun and working with a volvo mechanic, you would probably be closer to 2 or 3 with only hand tools and less experience than him, but i would be confident that it can be done in a weekend
240
OK then, sounds good - and time isn't a huge issue for me at the moment either.
The question is, how much mechanical ability/knowledge does it require? I'm always happy to learn new things but I've never done any major repairs on cars before, and I do have a friend I may be able to do it with who knows a bit more than I do but I want to make sure I wouldn't end up with a car without a transmission that I wouldn't be able to fix!
240
Thought I'd just put up an update - the one here in Canberra had sold by the time I rang the seller up so if anyone knows of a 240 for sale in Canberra area or Sydney or Adelaide, it'd be great if you could let me know. Cheers.
240
Just found this one on Gumtree:
http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/eagle-vale/cars-vans-utes/loading-/1081745504
I wanted a wagon but a sedan's not the end of the world, so what do you think of it?
How hard would the "minor power steering leak" be to fix?
I sent the seller an email and he only wants $200 so it could even be worth getting as a parts/manual donor car if I were to get a wagon later on.
I know it's hard to make a judgement without actually seeing the car but from the ad, do you think it's worth considering?
(The problem is that I'm in Canberra so if I were to travel to Sydney to get it, I wouldn't be able to change my mind once I got there.)
lasercowboy
It's worth 3x that just for the manual 'box and associated bits, so you can't really lose! the noted faults are all pretty easy fixes. you could put on an entire recon rack for <$200.
240
Well it would be worth it for the manual box etc if I had an auto at the moment to put it into, which I don't (and nor do I have space to store it) - but I get your point.
Even if I were just to keep this and use it, in a worst case scenario I probably wouldn't have to spend a cent over $1000 on repairs, would I? In which case I'd end up with a good car for $1200. But probably less.
My only concern is that if there ends up being something about it that would prevent me from buying it, I'd end up travelling to Sydney for nothing...
How hard would it be to put on a reconditioned rack?
lasercowboy
It's a 27 year old car with 300,000 kms - there will probably be other stuff! But the beauty of these beasts is that most of it is fairly easily rectified and a lot can be done yourself. As long as the engine and gearbox are strong, you're in pretty good shape. It doesn't look like it has terminal rot or collapsed rear suspension, so personally I'd chance it. Even as scrap, value is >$200, so you really can't lose on this.
240
That's what I thought, really - I've never owned a 240 myself but I know that they're fairly easy to fix. Even if it has a couple of engine issues it probably wouldn't be a big deal.
In your experience, are there any common-ish things that might cause it not to make the journey from Sydney to Canberra?
